От Chestnut
К Hvostoff
Дата 11.05.2007 14:38:22
Рубрики WWII; Современность;

Это просто феерично ))) О полтавской базе В-17 клиент не слышал (-)
От Hvostoff
К Chestnut (11.05.2007 14:38:22)
Дата 11.05.2007 14:45:16

Результаты работы с Полтавы лучше расскажите(-)
От Chestnut
К Hvostoff (11.05.2007 14:45:16)
Дата 11.05.2007 15:22:41

Для Вашего сведения -- первый налёт на Плоешти был

1 августа 1943 года, когда 178 Либерейторов нанесли удар по нефтепромыслам с баз в Северной Африке. Это к Вашим заявлениям, что румынскую нефть стали бомбить только перед приходом Красной Армии.

А по поводу использования базы в Полтаве, то вот только за июнь 1944 года:

06/02/44

Fifteenth AF

Shuttle-bombing between Italy and USSR (Operation FRANTIC) is started. Under cmd of Gen Eaker, 130 B-17's, escorted by 70 P-51's, bomb M/Y at Debreczen and land in Soviet Union-- the HBs at Poltava and Mirgorod, the ftrs at Piryatin. 1 HB is lost over tgt. 27 other B-17's, forced off course en route to Oradea M/Y, also hit Debreczen. Nearly 400 other HBs attack M/Ys at Szeged, Miskolc, Szolnok, Cluj, Simeria, and Oradea. P-51's and P-38's provide escort.

06/21/44

Eighth AF

The Eighth begins shuttle bombing missions (FRANTIC) between UK and bases in USSR. P-47's (2 gps) escort the HBs from just off German coast to Stendal where a P-51 gp continues escort to, and spt over, the tgt (synthetic oil plant at Ruhland). 123 B-17's bomb primary tgt, 21 bomb Elsterwerda, and a lone B-17 bombs Riesa due to a bomb rack malfunction. After the attack, the supporting P-51 gp is relieved 50 mi SE of Poznan by 65 other P-51's which are to accompany the HBs to USSR. 50 mi SE of Brest Litovsk 20 to 30 ftrs attack the force. In the resulting battle 1 US and 6 German ftrs are destroyed. A single B-17 is lost (to unknown causes) on the flight. 144 HBs land in USSR, 73 at Poltava, and the rest at Mirgorod. The 64 remaining P-51's land at Piryatin. The shuttle run is made in conjunction with a large-scale effort against tgts in Berlin area. 935 HBs attack city areas, motor industries, and T/Os in and near Berlin, Genshagen, Basdorf, Rangsdorf, Trebbin, Belzig, Potsdam, Stendal, and surrounding areas. 19 HBs are lost. Ftrs fly 902 sorties in spt of this mission, claiming 18 ftrs destroyed, with a loss of 6. In late afternoon 31 B-24's bomb CROSSBOW supply sites at Oisemont/Neuville and Saint-MartinL'Hortier and 39 bomb rocket site at Siracourt. AA fire shoots down 1 B-24. 3 ftr gps fly 101 sorties, meeting no enemy aircraft, but 1 gp strafes railroad and canal tgts. During 21/22 Jun the 73 B-17's which earlier landed at Poltava are attacked for 2 hrs by an estimated 75 German bmrs led by airplanes dropping flares. 47 HBs are destroyed and most of the remainder severely damaged. Heavy damage is also suffered by stores of fuel and ammo.

06/22/44

Eighth AF

In morning mission 216 HBs attack 12 CROSSBOW installations in Pas de Calais area. Some of the 212 spt ftrs strafe coastal defenses. During the afternoon 718 HBs attack 22 tgts in France and Belgium, including M/Ys transformer stations, A/Fs, bridges, fuel storage facilities, railroad facilities, CROSSBOW supply site, and numerous T/Os. Ftrs escort the mission and 3 P-47 gps strafe and bomb transportation tgts, destroying an ammo train, 6 other freight cars, and a truck. 8 HBs are lost, mostly to ground fire. Because of attack on B-17's at Poltava on shuttle mission, the B-17's at Mirgorod and P-51's at Piryatin are moved farther E into USSR. They are to be returned to Mirgorod and Piryatin to be dispatched to bases in Italy as soon as weather permits. The move is fortunate as German bmrs strike both Piryatin and Mirgorod during 22/23 Jun.

06/25/44

Eighth AF

During the morning 236 B-17's bomb Toulouse/Francazal and Toulouse/Blagnac A/F's and oil dumps at Montbartier. 10 B-17's bomb scattered T/Os. 107 B-24's bomb Avord and Bourges A/Fs. 176 B-17's drop supplies to French interior forces. A total of 8 HBs are lost. VIII FC flies 639 sorties in supporting operations. In addition 5 ftr gps carry out strafing activities, claiming numerous ground tgts including 6 airplanes on a landing ground and the A/F at Bourges. 19 enemy ftrs are claimed destroyed in aerial combat. During midday 153 B-24's bomb 17 power and transformer stations in effort to disrupt flow of electric power to V-weapon stations. 64 B-24's, hampered by cloud over primary aiming points, bomb miscellaneous last resort tgts, including A/Fs at Peronne and Nuncq. Ftr spt is provided by 3 gps. All airplanes return safely. In night mission 300 B-17's and B-24's bomb 7 railway bridges and 2 A/Fs in Paris area. 69 HBs attack alternate tgts, including A/Fs of Orly, Romilly-sur-Seine, and Etampes/Mondesir. Ftrs fly 346 sorties in escort and tgt area spt. A P-38 gp strafes ground tgts in Angers, Le Mans-Laval area, and a P-47 gp bombs and strafes an alternate landing ground near Evreux/Fauville A/F. HB losses total 7. Ftrs claim 6 airplanes destroyed against no losses. In USSR, Eighth AF HBs and ftrs are flown, at daybreak, from dispersal bases to Poltava and Mirgorod and loaded and fueled with intentions of bombing oil refinery at Drohobycz and proceeding to base in Italy. Bad weather cancels the mission until the following day. The aircraft return to dispersal bases for the night as precaution against air attacks."

06/26/44

Eighth AF

72 B-17's leave Poltava and Mirgorod, rendezvous with 55 P-51's from Piryatin, bomb oil refinery and M/Y at Drohobycz (1 returns to USSR because of mechanical trouble), and then proceed to Foggia. Fifteenth AF P-51's meet formation an hr after the attack and escort the B-17's to Italy. It is planned to return the HBs to bases in UK on 27 Jun but bad weather delays this move until 5 Jul.

https://www.airforcehistory.hq.af.mil/PopTopics/chron/44jun.htm




"Бій відлунав. Жовто-сині знамена затріпотіли на станції знов"
От Chestnut
К Chestnut (11.05.2007 15:22:41)
Дата 11.05.2007 17:21:54

точнее -- первый успешный налёт на Плоешти

потому что вообще первый (но неудачный) налёт был 12 июня 1942 года

"Бій відлунав. Жовто-сині знамена затріпотіли на станції знов"
От Hvostoff
К Chestnut (11.05.2007 15:22:41)
Дата 11.05.2007 15:37:26

Гуглить тут многие умеют, а вот внимательно читать оппонента - нет(+)

>1 августа 1943 года, когда 178 Либерейторов нанесли удар по нефтепромыслам с баз в Северной Африке. Это к Вашим заявлениям, что румынскую нефть стали бомбить только перед приходом Красной Армии.
Вы невнимательны.
В моем посту написано, что раздолбали нефтепромыслы как раз тогда, когда их могла КА захватить.
>А по поводу использования базы в Полтаве, то вот только за июнь 1944 года:
И где там работа по Ploesti ?
От Chestnut
К Hvostoff (11.05.2007 15:37:26)
Дата 11.05.2007 17:24:23

Работа по Плоешти

WEDNESDAY, 5 APRIL 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
334 B-17s and B-24s hit targets in Romania and Yugoslavia; the B-17s bomb a marshalling yard at Ploesti, Romania and Nis, Yugoslavia; the B-24s hit a marshalling yard at Ploesti and Leskovac, Yugoslavia; fighters and AA shoot down 13 bombers.

SATURDAY, 15 APRIL 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
Clearing weather again permits bomber operations. 448 B-17s and B-24s attack marshalling yards; B-17s hit Ploesti, Romania and Nis, Yugoslavia; B-24s hit Bucharest, Romania; 150+ fighters provide escort.


MONDAY, 24 APRIL 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
520+ bombers attack targets in R0mania, Yugoslavia, and Italy; B-17s bomb a marshalling yard at Ploesti, Romania, an aircraft factory in Belgrade, Yugoslavia and the Ancona-Rimini railroad line (this is the first Azon mission by 5 B-17s); the B-24s bomb marshalling yards at Ploesti and Bucharest, Romania; 250+ fighters fly support for the bombers.

FRIDAY, 5 MAY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
465th Bombardment Group (Heavy) with B-24s becomes operational, making a total of 20 heavy bomber groups operational in the Fifteenth Air Force.
640+ bombers (the largest force to date) attack targets in Romania and Yugoslavia; the B-17s hit marshalling yards at Ploesti/Campina and Brasnov, Romania; the B-24s hit the marshalling yard at Ploesti and troop concentrations at Podgoricu, Yugoslavia; fighters fly 240+ sorties in support.

SATURDAY, 6 MAY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
About 300 B-17s and B-24s, escorted by P-51s and P-38s, hit targets in Romania; the B-17s attack an aircraft factory at Brasov and marshalling yard at Turnu Severin; the B-24s bomb Ploesti/Campina marshalling yard and an aircraft factory at Brasov.

THURSDAY, 18 MAY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
Almost 450 bombers, mostly with fighter escort, hit targets in Rumania and Yugoslavia; both B-17s and B-24s bomb the industrial area at Ploesti, Romania and the marshalling yard at Belgrade, Yugoslavia.

WEDNESDAY, 31 MAY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
480+ B-17s and B-24s bomb oil refineries and communications targets in the Ploesti, Romania area; fighters fly 200+ sorties in support; 15 bombers are lost to flak and fighters; 40+ enemy aircraft are shot down.

TUESDAY, 6 JUNE 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
Shuttlebombing (Operation FRANTIC) continues as 104 B-17s and 42 P-51s (having flown to the USSR from Italy on 2 Jun) attack the airfield at Galati, Romania and return to Soviet shuttle bases; 8 enemy fighters are shot down and 2 P-51s are lost. 570+ other bombers, with fighter escort, hit targets from bases in Italy, i.e., in Yugoslavia, B-17s hit the Belgrade marshalling yard and Turnu-Severin canal installations, and in Romania, B-24s hit Ploesti oil refineries and the marshalling yard at Brasov.


SATURDAY, 10 JUNE 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
P-51s and P-38s fly escort, and in Romania, strafe targets of opportunity between Bucharest and the Danube River and S of Craiova, and dive-bomb an oil refinery at Ploesti.

FRIDAY, 23 JUNE 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
400+ B-17s and B-24s attack oil targets in Romania; the B-17s hit oil refineries at Ploesti; the B-24s also hit oil refineries at Ploesti and oil storage at Giurgiu. 100+ US aircraft are shot down; the bombers and escorting fighters claim 30+ aircraft destroyed.

SATURDAY, 24 JUNE 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
335 bombers attack targets in Romania; B-17s attack the railroad bridge at Piatra; B-24s bomb the railroad repair depot at Craiova and oil refinery at Ploesti; 33 P-51s sweep the Ploesti-Bucharest area while other P-51s, P-38s, and P-47s fly 220+ sorties in support of the bombers; the bombers and fighters claim 20+ aircraft shot down; 10 US aircraft are downed and several others are missing.

SUNDAY, 9 JULY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
In the Fifteenth's first Pathfinder-led mission, 222 B-17s and B-24s bomb Xenia and Concordia Vega oil refineries at Ploesti, Romania; P-38s and P-51s fly escort; other P-51s sweep the Ploesti area during the attacks; the bombers and fighters claim destruction of 14 of the 40-50 opposing fighters; 6 AAF aircraft are shot down.

SATURDAY, 15 JULY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
In Romania, 600+ B-17s and B-24s bomb 4 oil refineries in the Ploesti area and the Teleajenul pumping station; and P-51s and P-38s fly 300+ escort sorties.

SATURDAY, 22 JULY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
In Romania, 76 P-38s and 58 P-51s begin the second Fifteenth Air Force shuttle missions, attacking airfields at Zilistea and Buzau (claiming the destruction of 56 enemy aircraft) and landing at Operation FRANTIC bases in the USSR; 458 B-17s and B-24s (with fighter escorts) bomb an oil refinery at Ploesti and other bombers hit alternate targets of the Verciorova marshalling yard, Orsova railroad bridge, and Kragujevac, Yugoslavia marshalling yard.

WEDNESDAY, 26 JULY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
Fighters on the second shuttle mission leave USSR Operations FRANTIC bases, strafe enemy aircraft in the Bucharest-Ploesti, Romania area, and return to bases in Italy. In Austria, 330+ B-17s and B-24s attack the Wiener Neudorf aircraft factory, the airfield at Markersdorf, Thalerhof, Zwolfaxing, and Bad Voslau, and targets of opportunity in the Vienna area. Also hit are Szombathely Airfield, Hungary and oil storage at Berat, Albania. Fighters fly escort and carry out patrols and sweeps in the Brod-Zagreb, Yugoslavia and Ploesti-Bucharest, Romania areas; bombers and fighters claim 70+ enemy aircraft shot down.

FRIDAY, 28 JULY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
345 B-17s and B-24s attack 2 oil refineries at Ploesti, Romania and a marshalling yard at Florina, Greece; P-51s and P-38s provide support for the Ploesti raid.

MONDAY, 31 JULY 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
360+ bombers attack targets in Romania; B-17s hit an oil refinery at Ploesti; B-24s bomb 2 oil refineries at Bucharest, 1 at and Doicesti, and oil storage at Targoviste. Fighters escort the bombers.

SUNDAY, 6 AUGUST 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
60 fighters take off from Operation FRANTIC bases in the USSR, attack Craiova marshalling yard and other railroad targets in the Bucharest-Ploesti, Romania area, and land at Italian bases.

THURSDAY, 10 AUGUST 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
450+ B-17s and B-24s, with fighter escort, hit 6 oil refineries in the Ploesti, Romania area.

THURSDAY, 17 AUGUST 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
53 B-17s, with fighter cover, bomb Nish Airfield, Yugoslavia. 250 B-24s, escorted by P-51s, bomb 3 oil refineries and targets of opportunity in the Ploesti, Romania area.

FRIDAY, 18 AUGUST 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
370 fighter-escorted B-17s and B-24s bomb 5 oil refineries around Ploesti, Romania; 89 B-24s, with fighter cover, bomb Alibunar Airfield, Yugoslavia. The detachment of the 94th Fighter Squadron, 1st Fighter Group, operating from Aghione, Corsica with P-38s returns to base at Salsola Airfield, Italy.

SATURDAY, 19 AUGUST 1944
STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force):
Bombing the Ploesti, Romania area for the fourth consecutive day, 65 B-17s supported by 125 P-51s blast 2 oil refineries.


"Бій відлунав. Жовто-сині знамена затріпотіли на станції знов"
От Hvostoff
К Chestnut (11.05.2007 17:24:23)
Дата 11.05.2007 18:11:03

Ну и причем тут Полтава?(-)
От Chestnut
К Hvostoff (11.05.2007 18:11:03)
Дата 11.05.2007 19:05:42

Плоешти был в списке целей, плюс до него челноки пару раз таки добрались

а нефтяные комплексы в Венгрии и Румынии оони и по полной бомбили

"Бій відлунав. Жовто-сині знамена затріпотіли на станції знов"
От Hvostoff
К Chestnut (11.05.2007 19:05:42)
Дата 11.05.2007 19:25:36

Результаты впечатляют(-)
От Гриша
К Hvostoff (11.05.2007 15:37:26)
Дата 11.05.2007 15:39:16

КА взяла Берлин только когда союзники к ниму подходили с запада. Цинично. (-)
От Hvostoff
К Гриша (11.05.2007 15:39:16)
Дата 11.05.2007 15:45:50

Ну да. Берия циничен(с). Теперь вот и КА - вам и коприрайт(-)
От Гриша
К Hvostoff (11.05.2007 15:45:50)
Дата 11.05.2007 15:59:53

Народное, скорее (-)